From WO: The EU and Copyright

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Graaf Statler
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From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Graaf Statler » Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:15 am

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Ming wrote:Anything about international copyright functions under the historical reality that US rules were always different and almost invariably more permissive than European rules, plus the prohibition against ex post facto law in the constitution has always meant that anything that loses protection loses it forever. Intellectual property is far more slippery and hard to argue as anything much beyond a moral obligation. Ming has been hearing Graaf and other WP-haters go on about this for years, but even considering the huge enforcement problem that WP presents, the lack of serious litigation tends to speak louder than anything
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Ming, it is absolute unfair to put me down as a WP-hater because I try to give correct, neutral information about the European copyright and its dangers. It is as unreasonable as to say someone is a Thailand hater because he is warning not to take drugs to Thailand because it is dangers, and that you can get even the death penalty.
Many times I said to Romaine=>Wikimedia, Mdd, De Wikischim and the rest of the Dutch wiki-fools there arguments against me and to call me a troll like they did many, many times is as reasonable as blaming someone who is saying there are red traffic lights in this world and that you have to stop for them. And start to blame HIM for that traffic lights!

But that doesn't help. In there minds is the Pirate Party ruling in Europe. Jimbo believes that, Doc James believes that, they are convinced complete Europe is in a political crisis because of all the Romaine and Dimi bullshit. They are in a strange way brainwashed by the Pirate Party. What can I say? What can I do about it? It appears to me they are complete locked up in there reality gap.
But do me one favour and don't blame me for the extreem strict copyright laws in my country personally! That copyright law is from 1912, and if someone get the "clever" idea to left that copyright with copyleft it is not my tremendous blunder but theirs! Keep that in mind, they blundered, and not me! Don't try to blame me for there blunders, Ming.

But it is all fine for me, Ming. Because I am not a Wikipedia hater at all, I don't give a tiny rat's ass about Wikipedia, so how can I hate it? I don't care if Wikipedia is over hundred years still there, or it drowns in the sea, or if get erased, I don't care! I am a old man with three years primary school in five years how is building a model train and who doesn't give a fuck about "intellectual things"! Why should I care about Wikipedia? It is complete out of my field of interest.

The only thing I did was: A) Wondering why everybody was saying I was a troll from the first day on, B) Wondering why everybody reacted in a hysterical way when I said the way they were building up there reverence work was not correct, in my opinion, in a legal way and that was all! THEY started with all kind of repression, blocks bans, arbcom verdicts, SanFanBans, but not me! Ask them why, they did that and gave me at the end even a SanFanBan, but don't blame me constant for something i didn't do!

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by CrowsNest » Tue Feb 26, 2019 8:39 am

That thread has countless Wikipedians of high status (and some who think they are) all disagreeing about basic copyright stuff.

It says a lot that they are all devoted disciples of a project which is famous for adopting hardline positions in copyright disputes, when it benefits the cult. The Monkey selfie case being but one example.

Shit, the English Wikipedia regulars and their Wikipediocracy cousins are famously hostile to the people in the cult who are the closest they will ever get to having copyright experts, the Commons regulars.

They can talk about copyright when they start blocking Administrators like Ritchie333, for not only having moronic views on the subject, but acting on them on Wikipedia, up to and include insulting those who actually do know what the fuck they are talking about.

Fuck them all. Into the sea with the lot of them.

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Graaf Statler » Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:18 am

Special Newyorkbrad who is a lawyer should know much better! In general I mean, and not because of this topic. Because there is so much case law, a European court will always follow the European regulation and not the American. The protection of the American legal system stop at the American borders, so why are they only talking about American copyright? Most of the users and re-users are non-Americans and they have to deal with the laws and regulations and courts in the country's they are living in. Wikipedia and WMF are international operating organisations.

Fake news and disinformation, that is what they are spreading. Exacte where they are accusing the others of are they doing themselves on a large scale. They all do that.
Jimmy and Doc James with there Twitter accounts with Pirate Party bullshit and a wrong biased wiki article, last edited by the good doctor himself. These guys on WO with disinformation about copyright, even a New York lawyer does. Or better, wrong biased information, because the context is missing. Romaine=>Wikimedia together with Dimi, the "political scientist" with his useless "Brussels Advocating Group" did. WM-NL with its impressing Wikicon and Wikipedia is meer does. It's all the same (fake) story.
And why? To keep there pyramide of bluff, there pyramide schema of copyleft alive. And all these false prophets are fooling the complete world with repression, lying and fascist practises.

You all belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

John 8:44

Wikipedia is a present of the devil, it is WikiFaust,so indeed into the sea with it.
Last edited by Graaf Statler on Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Dysklyver » Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:06 am

Ming doesn't really get it. Ming speaks in generalities about US law, and "other laws", which to Ming's viewpoint is anything that isn't American.

Ming is of course American, like a quarter of Wikimedian's. But these Americans are disproportionately more likely to be an admin or vocalized editor, and have a fairly unified viewpoint based on "great American values" which is an awful lot like group arrogance.

Some Wikipediocrats have a good understanding of the issues, but for the most part they are talking about what they understand, turning the EU copyright thread into a debate about US copyright renewal, because to their minds those topics are somehow related.

And then of course the issue Crowsnest points out, that they can't even agree on this basic copyright stuff. :?

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Graaf Statler » Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:19 pm

If I want to be a respected Dutch Wikipedian I have to support both the vision on copyright of De Piraten Partij, and extreem radical feminisme. And if I don't do that or just shut up I am trolled out with brute force and heavy insults. It is as simple as that.
Romaine, Mdd, and the rest of the trolls and puddinheads (useful idiots) who doesn't understand what is going on are trolling arround with socks and are keeping the place clean and WMF is supporting this with there money and even with SanFanBan help as we have seen. Other visions are by the ruling party, the Dutch chapter, unacceptable.
They have the power and the assets in there hands, I can't do anything because at the moment I don't agree I am a troll out with a lot of gaslicht, and have to be disciplined by there sysops and there arbcom. And at the end even with a SanFanBan. And that is the situation on the Dutch WP.

Ming doesn't really get it. Ming speaks in generalities about US law, and "other laws", which to Ming's viewpoint is anything that isn't American


Not only Ming doesn't get it, most American users and a Canadian doctor doesn't get it.
10.563.456 persons has voted for our parlement in 2017 according to the official numbers. De Piraten Partij got 35.478 of these votes, 0,35%,
But the Piraten Party vision and arguments are used as the leading bias of WMF about copyright. And now Jimmy and the good doctor are thinking a political revolution will start in Europe because of article11 and 13.

Radical feminism is absolute not populair in Holland because our government is active supporting the rights and participation of woman and minorities successful. So this is not a surprise. And this is the result offend years years active supporting of WMF with a lot of money of fighting the so called gender bias with there one size fits all policy. Why dis this happen? Because WMF doesn't even understand a clou of everything what is not American.
But who knows this kind of gender articles writer by the gender lady AliceAlice makes every Dutch woman just as proud as Sandra, the director of the Dutch chapter as she reported to WMF, and will WP-NL recover complete.

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Graaf Statler » Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:14 pm

Newyorkbrad wrote: All of that is correct, but the Copyright Act of 1976 (the major copyright overhaul that took effect on January 1, 1978) did not restore copyright to any works that had already lost it. If the US copyright on a pre-1964 published work was not renewed, it lost US copyright protection 28 years after the copyright was issued. From that point on, the work was public domain in the US, just the same as if the work had never been copyrighted at all. As I noted above, in 1992 the renewal requirement was abolished, but only going-forward for works published beginning in 1964.

All of this is about UScopyright law only. Other countries' laws vary widely, both historically and today.

And if you know other countries' laws are vary widely, both historically and today, mister Newyorkbrad, why didn't you noticed long ago there could be appear a international copyright problem? You are a lawyer, you are a respected Wikipedian, a arb, you was even a keynote speaker, so why, why didn't you warn in a early stadium if you had this important information? Why didn't you share this with other wikipedians? You had every change to do so, but I didn't. Ok, maybe Ming doesn't understand what is going on, but you have to understand as a lawyer.
Because I tried to warn from 2012 on and we haven seen the result. A SanFanBan.
Why did you keep your mouth shut all the time mister? Because that is what I am wondering. Why didn't you interfere somewhere? Because you have had so many changes I never have had because I was mute all the time from the first day on.

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Dysklyver » Tue Feb 26, 2019 4:16 pm

I can't imagine Newyorkbrad speaking out about copyright, every Wikipedian thinks they know best, and if he said literally anything that too many people disagreed with then he would be pilloried. It doesn't really matter if he was right or not, Wikipedia can't countenance unpopular or dissident opinions from anyone. Even the Arb with his own article isn't immune to the mob.

This doesn't apply to the WMF of course, and if they said something then people would be obligated to listen. But it's pretty clear that the WMF is using their newfound politically lobby mission to support the Pirate Party, despite the fact that party is a pretty small single issue party that nobody really cares about.

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Graaf Statler » Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:15 pm

We have a long, long tradition of this kind of small single issue party where nobody take cares of, Arthur.

*The Rapaille Partij
*The Vrije Seks Partij (VSP)
*The Marxistisch-Leninistische Partij Nederland (MLPN)
*The Kommunistische Eenheidsbeweging Nederland (KEN)
*The Partij voor Naastenliefde, Vrijheid en Diversiteit (PNVD),
*The Verenigde Senioren Partij
* TROTS, Trots op Nederland,
*Jezus Leeft
*De piratenpartij
Etc., Etc.

They come and go and nobody ever takes care of them, every election a few of this party stand up and the Piraten Partij is just one of them. And after a few years they disappear complete. Most times they have non or at max one seat for one periode, but can't be taken serious. The only party's of this kind what where more or less successful where De boerenpartij of Boer Koekoek in the seventy's and De partij voor de Dieren, but the rest, no, zero.

And what is the success of De partij voor de dieren, the party for the animals?
Well, in the frist place it is a fuck-off party. If you don't know what to vote you vote De partij voor de dieren. In the second place, we, the Dutch like animals very much. There is a bitter joke now under the Syrian refugees, don't go to Holland, because you child come in the first place, that the cat and the dog, than your wife, and than at last you. You as a Arabic man is the last person in this world they care about.

My personal favoured is the Partij tot Liquidatie van Nederland (PLN), because the business plan was absolute briljant. Sell complete Holland, everything, and divide the money. De Nachtwacht of Rembrand, every piece of land and every house, every windmill, every firm, really anything, complete Holland. And every Dutch man an woman, inhibitor is very rich. Briljant isn't it?
Why didn't WMF support this party?
looks great to me, I just should buy a luxere luxurious villa at lake Como and one at lake Geneva and travel the rest of my life around the world. In wealthy. Fuck Holland, just sell it.

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Re: From WO: The EU and Copyright

Post by Graaf Statler » Wed Feb 27, 2019 1:11 pm

Newyorkbrad wrote:Historically, US-International copyright relations had been a mess, governed by a hodgepodge of individual treaties and protectionist requirements and arcane formalities that were difficult to comply with — “The Lord of the Rings” lapsing into the PD because of a Manufacturing Clause violation may be the best-known example, at least among nerds

I think that is a fair conclusion, and US-International copyright relations are still a mess. And that is the reason why article 13 will be pass and implanted in the national regulation of the European country's now. And it wouldn't surprise me at all if other country's, including the US take similar measures in the near future.
Because that happens all the time, country's and continents are copycats. If one country takes a measure the others often follow soon, you see that all the time. Because Europe and special France is protecting it's intellectual property heavy now and American artist and publishers for sure will put pressure on there governments to do the same. That is how it works.

And Julia Reda with her Pirate Party can twitter what she wants, but it is not of any influence and it never was.
In a few mounts The Pirate Party will end up in the junkyard of the political history beside the many, many other long forgotten one issue party's like Vrouw vooruit, Basis inkomenpartij, De sportpartij, etc, etc, etc. They are ephemeral, the are nothing, they are unimportant in the political field.

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