ADL faces Wikipedia ban over reliability concerns on Israel, antisemitism

[Bbb23sucks]

https://www.jta.org/2024/06/18/united-s ... tisemitism

[ericbarbour]

Ha ha. Another charming little screamfest.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... ion_League

And for some hysterical context:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... ion_League
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... nLeagueUSA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... ate_groups
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... ion_League

"Interesting" that whenever Wikipedia and "anti-hate groups" intersect, so much additional hatred is produced, eh? With added (fresh) sockpuppets.

And right below that is some kind of squabble about whether the Telegraph is a "reliable source" on transgender issues.

[ericbarbour]

You know things have changed when you see little squibs like this. NGO Monitor and its shrieky leader Gerald Steinberg spent years fighting with Israel critics and anyone else he didn't like--his specialty being defamatory fake-news "hit pieces" against any organization or charity that objected to Israel's treatment of Palestinians or Muslims in general, even Israeli groups. He tried to sue the EU and the UN, and failed. One of Netanyahu's favorite trolls. No one knows how many dirty tricks Steinberg and his supporters pulled on WP, and most likely, there will never be any accounting.

Earlier this year, they banned NGO Monitor, a Jerusalem-based pro-Israel advocacy group.

For good reason.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... th_them%3F

And that was only after something like eighteen years of open warfare.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... GO_Monitor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... and_others
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... omination)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... omination)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... c_Garlasco
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia ... GO_Monitor

And many, many more....

[badmachine]

the adl was found to be unreliable wrt State of Israel/Palestine, and the adl has responded by inviting people to email wikipedia/wmf/whatever to plead for an "investigation", which the wikipedians have taken as an invitation to harass/intimidate them, of course.

here's what the adl wants you to send to the wmf board (hatted at AN, of course):

Full text
I write to you as an ADL supporter to express my deep concern and utter dismay regarding the attacks by some Wikipedia editors on ADL’s reliability on the topic of antisemitism and other issues of central concern to the Jewish community. Fundamentally, if these editors are successful, Wikipedia will be stripping the Jewish community of the right to define the hatred that targets our community. It is impossible to imagine any other community having its own definition of hatred questioned or challenged in this manner.

ADL is a leading global authority on antisemitism, and the Jewish community has, for decades, relied on ADL’s data and resources to help us and society at large understand the nature, scope, and magnitude of antisemitism in the U.S. and around the globe. ADL is consistently attacked from both the far left and far right, demonstrating its commitment to calling balls and strikes in a nonpartisan way, based on data and evidence.

The International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (“IHRA”) Working Definition of Antisemitism is the preeminent and most widely accepted definition of antisemitism today, embraced in the 2023 U.S. National Strategy to Counter Antisemitism and adopted or endorsed by more than half of the U.S. states as well as the District of Columbia. It is also used by over 1,000 other governments, universities, NGOs, and other key institutions, demonstrating a clear international consensus. An attack on any Jewish communal organization's reliability over its use of the IHRA definition and advocacy on behalf of the Jewish people is an attack on the entire Jewish community.

Antisemitism is one of the oldest and most pernicious forms of hate, and it is also in many ways one of the most often misunderstood. ADL has studied, monitored, and worked to counter antisemitism for decades. ADL – indeed the entire Jewish community – should be given the deference and respect to define anti-Jewish oppression – the same respect other communities are afforded. I am deeply concerned that if these editors are successful, it will enable others to undermine the Jewish community’s claims or charges of antisemitism and simultaneously use Wikipedia as cover to perpetuate antisemitism. At a time when antisemitic attitudes are increasing and antisemitic incidents are skyrocketing, this is simply unacceptable, and it puts our entire community at risk.

I urge you to immediately launch an investigation into this effort and the motivations behind it, and to start the process for administrative reconsideration. I hope that you will simultaneously speak out clearly and unequivocally in support of the Jewish community’s right to define and defend against antisemitism - and that of all marginalized communities as they both define and grapple with the hate they face.

h/t to KF 'dumb shit on wikipedia' thread

(edited. AN, not AN/I)

[ericbarbour]

the adl was found to be unreliable wrt State of Israel/Palestine, and the adl has responded by inviting people to email wikipedia/wmf/whatever to plead for an "investigation", which the wikipedians have taken as an invitation to harass/intimidate them, of course.

And big deal---ADL members and their "friends" have been doing this on Wikipedia since its earliest days. It's ROUTINE. They took the "Holocaust guilt syndrome" and beat it into a froth, on WP and everywhere else in American society, and now other Jews, non-Jews, Palestinians and non-Palestinians are getting sick of it. Fanatics do nothing but cause ruin.

[boredbird]

Wikipedia/ Jimbo blocked Raquel for thoughtcrime maybe now (after genocide in Gaza) they’ll she was right?

If there is "genocide" in Gaza this means you were right that the Holocaust didn't happen? That makes no sense at all, does it?

[badmachine]

Wikimedia Foundation statement on volunteer processes on reliable sources

[ericbarbour]

Wikimedia Foundation statement on volunteer processes on reliable sources

Hilarious, and exactly what I expect them to say. Plus this:

The ADL remains a generally reliable source on Wikipedia, outside of the topic of the Israel/Palestine conflict.

In which case they need to apply a similar rule to a LOT of "reliable sources", because so damn many of them are pushing a political agenda, when they are talking about their LOCAL politics. Russia Today, Al Jazeera, nearly every UK newspaper, virtually every outlet the Murdochs own, etc. etc. The list goes on forever.

If the numpties banned EVERY media organization that "might not be" a "reliable source", at least 80-90% of the article references would have to be removed.

[Archer]

Wikimedia Foundation statement on volunteer processes on reliable sources

Hilarious, and exactly what I expect them to say. Plus this:

The ADL remains a generally reliable source on Wikipedia, outside of the topic of the Israel/Palestine conflict.

In which case they need to apply a similar rule to a LOT of "reliable sources", because so damn many of them are pushing a political agenda, when they are talking about their LOCAL politics. Russia Today, Al Jazeera, nearly every UK newspaper, virtually every outlet the Murdochs own, etc. etc. The list goes on forever.

If the numpties banned EVERY media organization that "might not be" a "reliable source", at least 80-90% of the article references would have to be removed.

"The ADL remains a generally reliable source on Wikipedia, outside of the topic of the Israel/Palestine conflict" - This fine exemplar of hair-splitting is damage control, not a serious assessment of the ADL's honesty or lack thereof. So what if the ADL can't be cited on the I/P issue? The majority of western mass media is highly consolidated and so slanted in Israel's favor that they largely ignore war crimes and the resulting genocide case against Israel, besides occasional token coverage. The headline of https://www.thenation.com/article/socie ... sm-claims/ puts it very concisely: "Posing as a civil rights group, the ADL has long operated as an intelligence organization targeting Israel’s critics. So why does the media still treat it as a credible source?"

[Archer]

Wikipedia/ Jimbo blocked Raquel for thoughtcrime maybe now (after genocide in Gaza) they’ll she was right?

If there is "genocide" in Gaza this means you were right that the Holocaust didn't happen? That makes no sense at all, does it?

Holocaust denial has never seemed a productive argument to me. One atrocity does not justify another, nor should it immunize the victims' entire race (races, actually - Jews weren't the only victims of the Holocaust, let alone the war) and all their progeny against criticism. One can acknowledge the Holocaust and still criticize the actions of Israel, the lobby, or any other group.