Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Fram 2

[Kumioko]

As a side note, it would be very interesting to see how many, if any, edits are being made from prisons or like facilities.

Maybe Colonel Henry can start editing again..lol

More than the reader would expect, I think.

In de gevangenis maakte Frank kennis met een Albanese medegevangene. „Die jongen had een roofoverval gepleegd. Als je de hele tijd met iemand optrekt, krijg je toch een band. Ik leerde hem Engels.”
Also evidence that Frank Masmeijer is proficient in English.

We all know Frank Masmeijer here in Holland, Guido, He is constant in the news here, our deep fallen TV host.

Which would explain why Fram doesn't edit on nl:wp. Outside the Netherlands and Belgium, however, he is completely unknown.

That's very interesting thanks. Now that Fram is no longer an admin and can't hide behind those protections, it's very possible his identity might be discovered. Bbb23 might even block him in one of his unwarranted sock hunting dragnets.

[badmachine]

As a side note, it would be very interesting to see how many, if any, edits are being made from prisons or like facilities.

Maybe Colonel Henry can start editing again..lol

More than the reader would expect, I think.

In de gevangenis maakte Frank kennis met een Albanese medegevangene. „Die jongen had een roofoverval gepleegd. Als je de hele tijd met iemand optrekt, krijg je toch een band. Ik leerde hem Engels.”
Also evidence that Frank Masmeijer is proficient in English.

We all know Frank Masmeijer here in Holland, Guido, He is constant in the news here, our deep fallen TV host.

Which would explain why Fram doesn't edit on nl:wp. Outside the Netherlands and Belgium, however, he is completely unknown.

That's very interesting thanks. Now that Fram is no longer an admin and can't hide behind those protections, it's very possible his identity might be discovered. Bbb23 might even block him in one of his unwarranted sock hunting dragnets.

Those are warranted. Without those, how will Wikipedia be able to point out what a bunch of evil sockpuppeteers banned users are?

[Graaf Statler]

When I was around 30 years old Frank Masmeijer was a rising star and showmaster. People stayed home for his shows, because it was the time before everyone had a video recorder. He was extreem, extreem populair in that time. His show was a great succes.

But something went wrong, and he has derailed complete with business drama''s, later drug smuggle, very weird.
He came in a spin, went slowly downer and downer.. And of course he was/is on a regulair base in the headlines, Because special older peeps remember him as THE immense populair star, TV host.

[Guido den Broeder]

When I was around 30 years old Frank Masmeijer was a rising star and showmaster. People stayed home for his shows, because it was the time before everyone had a video recorder. He was extreem, extreem populair in that time. His show was a great succes.

I watched other shows, but never his. He seemed fake to me right from the start.

On 17 May 2019, when Frank Masmeijer got moved to another prison, Fram didn't edit between 08:18 and 15:59 (local time).

[Kumioko]

Those are warranted. Without those, how will Wikipedia be able to point out what a bunch of evil sockpuppeteers banned users are?

I assume this to be sarcasm. There are a lot of problems with the CU tool, CU's and the culture. Especially for guys like Bbb23, who violate the CU tool policy by using it for unsanctioned fishing expeditions.

[Guido den Broeder]

For what it is worth, I think it plainly obvious that Fram was not "railroaded" by ArbCom. I've read their decision and looked at the evidence, and they acted in a balanced and thoughtful way. Fram, if our systems were working better, should have been desysopped a long time ago - his failed RfA shows why. His conduct was not appropriate for that position. Normally in disagreements around behavioral issues and what to do about them, there are two basic kinds of disagreements we might have. One kind of disagreement is around the facts of what the conduct actually was. The other is a more philosophical disagreement around what the principles may be. I believe, in this case, there is little disagreement about the facts - Fram's problematic behavior was pretty universally acknowledged, in some cases - and to his credit - even by him. And I think the RfA gives a strong indication of a lack of community consensus that his behavior as an admin was ok.

As to whether Fram should have been banned - I think that's a complex matter, but I would have equally supported the ArbCom had they made that decision. My view is that absent some kind of egregious abuse of a ArbCom gone mad, in which my (theoretical?) reserve powers to call a new election would be in play, it is extremely important that the community support strongly the principle of an independent, respected ArbCom. If you disagree with a particular decision, it's perfectly fine to say so. If you disagree in some really very strong way, it's perfectly fine to run for office as a member of ArbCom on that platform. What I think is not very helpful is to undermine the authority of ArbCom while simultaneously rejecting (rightly, in my view) the idea that the WMF should step in to detailed internal user issues in the fashion of twitter/youtube staff moderation. You can have the one, or you can have the other. You can't have anarchy as that would lead to Wikipedia being overrun by trolls.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 01:05, 2 October 2019 (UTC)

Quite perceptive our Jimbo, except of course that he failed to notice that Wikipedia got overrun by trolls many years ago.

[CrowsNest]

Snap!

https://www.wikipediasucks.co/forum/vie ... 015#p14015

[CrowsNest]

he failed to notice that Wikipedia got overrun by trolls many years ago.

I think he knows it, after all, how can he otherwise explain the failures of ArbCom that led to FRAMGATE?

Whether he's just a born optimist, or doesn't want to admit Larry Sanger was right all those years ago now (lunatics took over the asylum), or whether it would just be too massively damaging from a PR perspective, he just doesn't want to admit it.

[Graaf Statler]

I watched other shows, but never his. He seemed fake to me right from the start.

Most man did't I suppose, Guido. He was extreme populair by woman, most man where only suffering him. His public where for the most woman.

I never liked the man, some instinkt I suppose. I is really amazing he is reincarnate in my life again, because of course I heard about his law case, you cant miss it in Holland, but there have been years and years he didn't cross one single second my mind.

By the way, did you notice he has no article on WP-En?

I think you have a full hit, Guido, 9 years in prison for cocaine smuggle and a fine of 90.000 euro.

That is a sysop to fight for, wikipedians! Well done!

[Graaf Statler]

Whether he's just a born optimist, or doesn't want to admit Larry Sanger was right all those years ago now (lunatics took over the asylum), or whether it would just be too massively damaging from a PR perspective, he just doesn't want to admit it.

Well, you have to be a tremendous optimist if you don't understand if this get public both in Belgium and Holland this scandal ends up high on the political agenda on government level.