Wikipedia Sucks!

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Nederland

How is it doing? Is it doing any better than Wikimedia France?

IMO the only 2 that are doing relatively well are Dutch and the DC chapter. Most of the rest are failing and don't provide any value for the money.

Kumioko wrote:IMO the only 2 that are doing relatively well are Dutch and the DC chapter. Most of the rest are failing and don't provide any value for the money.

They are in a impossible position. Wikipedia-NL is a chaos, a boondoggie, filled up with nonsens and copyvio. and should be erased. A part of there members behave themselves like idiots, trolls on Wikipedia, and Wikimedia-NL knows this. But they don't have any power to change it, because of the wiki-system, so in front of there eyes they see how there flagship is sinking.
And, they are many times warned by a lawyer, Peter B, on the other hand they are too deep involved in Wikipedia-NL to be legal independent from Wikipedia-NL, because of our legal system. So, on one hand they are probably responsible for what happens on Wikipedia, but powerless to change something. And why do I write probably? Because of our European casino legal system. You never know what a judge is going to do! Vor Gericht und auf hoher See ist man in Gottes Hand In the courtroom room and on the high seas one is in God's hand. And that is true. Only if something was in court you are sure about something in Europe.

It's a pity it is in Dutch, but what anonymous 4 sep 2017 08:03 (CEST) is writing is very interesting. The topic is about the the BUS case in Sweden. Peter B, the (real) lawyer, is asking, is it right we spend money on this kind of trails. For Romaine of course it's right, but he is a proven Wikimedia troll, and everything what contains the word wiki is fantastic in his eyes, and a place to troll in the highest gear. And what he is claiming is so terrible wrong using the donor money for political goals, without telling it to the people who are giving that money!

(Als we in België aan donateurs uitleggen dat we geld besteed hebben om in de politiek aandacht te vragen voor het probleem van panoramavrijheid (en daar ook nog een verandering door verwezenlijkt hebben), zijn ze erg blij dat Wikimedia dat doet.)(If we explain to donors in Belgium we spent money asking politically for the problem of panorama freedom (and have also implemented a change), they are very pleased that Wikimedia does. (robot) Verification required, and you have to tell that before! A very good reason to close Wikimedia-BE now!)

But what anonymous is writing is interesting. In the first place he notice the goal of the Wiki mouvement has changed. The goal is not anymore writing a encyclopedia, It's has changed in a free source movement and most board members of Wikimedia-NLhave never been active on Wikipedia. Some of them are paid, also in Holland. So, it's a good question if it is right to ask with banners money for Wikipedia, keep Wikipedia in the air, what you are spending for something else. And I am saying that if I look at the results of the efforts Wikimedia-NL, it is a nothing more or less than a cover to create a few nice well paid jobs, so it's just as rubbish as the rest.
So they are liars, because they get there money in a false way. They use money, given to keep Wikipedia floating for something totally different. And are main supplier of trolls on wikipedia, allow it, and support them, otherwise they had kicked them years ago out of Wikimedia! It's hypocrite. On one hand they are saying we can't do anything, on the other hand they are pampering a bunch of internet trolls. Were they likely legal responsible for are, and in every means morally.

In short, there philosophy got 30.600 votes in Holland by the general election in 2014, to be exacte 0,3% of the votes, and now they are trying by Romania, a wikimedia troll from the first category with his trollomedia-BE with donor money, what is given to improve Wikipedia, to reach there goals by lobbing in the European parlement! Because of course the guy's who are trolling in Wikipedia-NL, Wikimedia-NL and BE, belong to that pirate movement.
And that is OK for me, but not on the expense of the donors who doesn't know what they are supporting. And not by reach their goals by trolling, what is forbidden by the law, by the way. Wikimedia-NL and Wikimedia-BE are a political movements, and not something to support Wikipedia!

Look Flip, interesting.

A few highlights:

"Als wij kunnen bijdragen aan een politiek of juridisch klimaat waarin het delen van kennis makkelijker wordt, zullen we dat zeker in overweging nemen. Sandra Rientjes - Wikimedia Nederland (overleg) 5 sep 2017 12:47 (CEST)"

(If we can contribute to a political or legal environment what makes sharing of knowledge easier, we will certainly take that into So, consideration." Sandra Rientjes - Wikimedia Netherlands 5 September 2017 12: 47 (CEST))

"Ik verbaas me inmiddels nergens meer over, maar als de vereniging actief op zoek gaat naar sponsors om zijn activiteiten mee te financieren is dat dan niet iets dat ook de bredere gemeenschap aangaat? Dit nav de link die hierboven gelegd wordt naar een nieuw bestuurslid dat er prat op gaat nog nimmer een lemma te hebben geschreven. Mag ik van Romaine heel hard roepen dat ik heel erg tegen het aantrekken van sponsors ben? Als de vereniging het financieel niet kan bolwerken met de bijdrage uit de VS dan zou het voor de hand liggen om te snijden in de activiteiten ipv de onafhankelijkheid te verkwanselen. Peter b (overleg) 5 sep 2017 14:07 (CEST)"

Peter claims, it's wrong Wikimedia-NL is searching for extern sponsor money. If the money of WMF is not enough, they have to cut there their expenses, because otherwise they are not independent anymore

And if you summarize this hole topic in De Kroeg, it's clear Wikimedia-NL want to change in a foundation with extern sponsor money, and in a free source movement, whit a political agenda. And they don't even have consulted the Dutch community.
So, they do what ever they want with the donor money of the Foundation, and are not using the money in the way they to have to.

Graaf Statler wrote:Look Flip, interesting.

A few highlights:

"Als wij kunnen bijdragen aan een politiek of juridisch klimaat waarin het delen van kennis makkelijker wordt, zullen we dat zeker in overweging nemen. Sandra Rientjes - Wikimedia Nederland (overleg) 5 sep 2017 12:47 (CEST)"

(If we can contribute to a political or legal environment what makes sharing of knowledge easier, we will certainly take that into So, consideration." Sandra Rientjes - Wikimedia Netherlands 5 September 2017 12: 47 (CEST))

"Ik verbaas me inmiddels nergens meer over, maar als de vereniging actief op zoek gaat naar sponsors om zijn activiteiten mee te financieren is dat dan niet iets dat ook de bredere gemeenschap aangaat? Dit nav de link die hierboven gelegd wordt naar een nieuw bestuurslid dat er prat op gaat nog nimmer een lemma te hebben geschreven. Mag ik van Romaine heel hard roepen dat ik heel erg tegen het aantrekken van sponsors ben? Als de vereniging het financieel niet kan bolwerken met de bijdrage uit de VS dan zou het voor de hand liggen om te snijden in de activiteiten ipv de onafhankelijkheid te verkwanselen. Peter b (overleg) 5 sep 2017 14:07 (CEST)"

Peter claims, it's wrong Wikimedia-NL is searching for extern sponsor money. If the money of WMF is not enough, they have to cut there their expenses, because otherwise they are not independent anymore

And if you summarize this hole topic in De Kroeg, it's clear Wikimedia-NL want to change in a foundation with extern sponsor money, and in a free source movement, whit a political agenda. And they don't even have consulted the Dutch community.
So, they do what ever they want with the donor money of the Foundation, and are not using the money in the way they to have to.

Yes, it sounds like they are changing their mission. The WMF also expanded their mission from supporting the projects to fighting for free knowledge sharing. The Dutch chapter does not seem to have a very active membership. I would think that paying members might be curious about what they are paying for. Do you know how many paying members the Dutch chapter has?

Flip Flopped wrote:Yes, it sounds like they are changing their mission. The WMF also expanded their mission from supporting the projects to fighting for free knowledge sharing. The Dutch chapter does not seem to have a very active membership. I would think that paying members might be curious about what they are paying for. Do you know how many paying members the Dutch chapter has?

Yes, but why does the WMF also expanded their mission from supporting a activist, political movement, what does't respect the copyright law of our country, with members who want to reach there goals by trolling? Only 30.600 voters in Holland, and by the general election in 2014 0,3% of the votes supports there vision! And they are lying about there mission to there donors, both Wikimedia-BE and Wikimedia-NL. And of course Wikimedia-BE didn't change that panorama right, the Belgium parlement did.

The copyright rules does't change in Europe, they get stronger, politicians and judges wants to protect our intellectual property. Europe is very, very nationalist and conservative, that is the reason they want to keep the European parlement as powerless as possible. And there they are lobbing with there Wikimedia-BE!

Anglo-Saxons don't understand Europe. That was the reason Varoufakis mission went so wrong. He wanted to implanted the Anglo-Saxons economic system in our social market economy ( It's the same there wiki lawyer try with there commons law they wanted to implante in our Code Napoleon, that is impossible. There mission is impossible and a complete wasting of money.

And here, Flip you can see the general costs. Form the 456.050 euro they are spending, 240.000 is wages, and with costs like renting a office, telecom, etc it's 291.050. So, form there 456.050 euro is 165.000 euro left for their totally ignorant activities. It should be interesting to have a specification about that wages, I only know the complete incompetent Sandra earns around 6000 euro a per month.

Graaf Statler wrote:And here, Flip you can see the general costs. Form the 456.050 euro they are spending, 240.000 is wages, and with costs like renting a office, telecom, etc it's 291.050. So, form there 456.050 euro is 165.000 euro left for their totally ignorant activities. It should be interesting to have a specification about that wages, I only know the complete incompetent Sandra earns around 6000 euro a per month.

Have you or anyone you know ever visited their offices? Have they hired anyone with expertise from outside of the WM movement to run the office?

Have you ever read the external audit of the WM UK Chapter?

FYI: The state legal system in the U.S. state of Louisiana is also more closely based on the Napoleonic Code than on Anglo-Saxon law.

Flip Flopped wrote:Have you or anyone you know ever visited their offices? Have they hired anyone with expertise from outside of the WM movement to run the office?

Have you or anyone you know ever visited their offices?

*No. I had such an antipathy against Wikimedia-NL the first moment, I wouldn't have anything to do with them. Because from the first moment I was scolded by a prominent Wikimedia member, Bas. He is still active in Wikimedia. Whatever I said, he started to abuse me, supported by the other wikimedia members or sympathizers like CaAL, Vinvlugt, a guy called Chris, who made a sport out of it to insult me, and more of them. It was a clique. They never, never wrote a article, and it was all united in Wikimedia. I never met one of them.

*Have they hired anyone with expertise from outside of the WM movement to run the office?

**I don't know, but I have not the impression they ever rented a outsider. Most times what I see it's a complete incompetent person who they know, but nobody on Wikipedia knows. Wikimedia-NL is a kind of powerful deep state in Wikipedia.

*Have you ever read the external audit of the WM UK Chapter?

**I don't know nothing from other wiki's or other Wikimedia's. Mister James Alexander threw me on the international stage.

*FYI: The state legal system in the U.S. state of Louisiana is also more closely based on the Napoleonic Code than on Anglo-Saxon law.

**aggie told me before, but Europe is a other continent. It means, it's complete different build up than the States, and even England. That is one of the reasons why the English wanted to leave the EU. Everything here in Europe is complete different, you can't compare it. A lawyer, specialist, pointed me out that was the reason why american firms like Disney and MacDonald use a system of licenses, to avoid this kind of problems. I gave the example before, WMF tries to sell 110 volt refrigerators in Europa, were the voltage is 220 volt.